Oil dripping off starter

[Snips]

Is it possible for starter to fill with primary oil?
2010 K-9. I put in a new starter recently. I have only gone about 150 miles since. At the same time, I completely drained primary. (Removed the primary cover, not just the inspection cover). I inspected the primary vent which was original. I broke it putting it back in and purchased a new one. After the 150 miles, oil was dripping off starter. Never had any leaks on the bike ever. I could confirm that leak was not coming from the o-ring area where starter mounts to primary. It’s just dripping off the lowest most portion off the starter. Am I losing my goddamn mind?

 

[Mr. Wright]

Your Primary only holds 22ozs of oil. If you over filled it, it will create more pressure than your vent can handle. The next easiest way for the oil to get out, is through the starter

 

[Rottweiler]

Yes,

This is from another post earlier.

He meant to say how much oil did you put in it...only put 20 to 22 ounces in the primary...manual will say more but dont do what the manual says or oil will come out around the starter...also on the end of your starter is a o-ring that seals it into the primary and that could be bad...or as Mick said your vent may be plugged up creating pressure in the primary.

 

[Snips]

Yes, that’s the exact amount of oil in there. The o-ring is fine……no oil leaking at that connection. Vent is new (I confirmed it was clean by shining a light through it before installing). I’ve never dissected a starter. I imagine there’s a seal around the shaft that throws out the pinion gear on the starter. I suppose I should have asked if it’s possible that I got a poorly sealed starter? Does this oil in the starter force me to buy a new one?

 

[Mr. Wright]

Where did you get the starter from? HDM and WSW both sell updated starter with better seals. Others might not.

 

[Snips]

Where did you get the starter from? HDM and WSW both sell updated starter with better seals. Others might not.

Got it direct from BDM.

 

[Snuffy]

Got it direct from BDM.

I would try replacing the o ring and while the starter is off make sure there isn’t a piece of flash from the casting or something else going on around the area where it seals

 

[knothead]

Bite the bullet and order the bullet nose starter for 499.99....the oil relief in the other starters didnt fix nothing.... if and when the billet nose starter goes bad all you have to do is buy the cheaper nose starter for 349.99 and put your billet nose on it...they are the same starter just a different nose...billet nose is more precision part.

Like stated above by Mr.Wright refill using 20 to 22 ounces...if you didnt take the cover off and wipe out all the oil then all I would use is 18 ounces to refill it...reason i say that is because there will be 4 ounces of left over oil in there because of all the pockets inside the primary...

 

[Snips]

Bite the bullet and order the bullet nose starter for 499.99....the oil relief in the other starters didnt fix nothing.... if and when the billet nose starter goes bad all you have to do is buy the cheaper nose starter for 349.99 and put your billet nose on it...they are the same starter just a different nose...billet nose is more precision part.

Like stated above by Mr.Wright refill using 20 to 22 ounces...if you didnt take the cover off and wipe out all the oil then all I would use is 18 ounces to refill it...reason i say that is because there will be 4 ounces of left over oil in there because of all the pockets inside the primary...
[/QUOTE
I did take cover off and completely wiped the inside spotless. I’ve gotta look into whatever you’re talking about regarding oil reliefs in starters. I’ve put the exact amount of oil you suggested back in the primary. For some reason the oil is getting into the starter. It’s definitely not leaking past the mounting o-ring. It’s just dripping off the very bottom of starter housing

 

[Mikeinjersey]

I would pull the starter and inspect it to see if oil has gone inside. If so, clean it out and put it back together. Since you just replaced the starter it's more likely you damaged the O-ring seal on the way back in or the primary seal is not seated correctly. Oil like water can be difficult at times to determine the source. Clean everything up nice and look for the leak to reappear without using the bike. If no leak it means the primary cover was installed correctly. Now, use the bike and if you were successful re-installing the starter with the new o-ring and the fluid level is at 20-22 oz you should be OK. The new vent means that is not an issue. Good Luck

 

[Snips]

I would pull the starter and inspect it to see if oil has gone inside. If so, clean it out and put it back together. Since you just replaced the starter it's more likely you damaged the O-ring seal on the way back in or the primary seal is not seated correctly. Oil like water can be difficult at times to determine the source. Clean everything up nice and look for the leak to reappear without using the bike. If no leak it means the primary cover was installed correctly. Now, use the bike and if you were successful re-installing the starter with the new o-ring and the fluid level is at 20-22 oz you should be OK. The new vent means that is not an issue. Good Luck

There’s Mike. Wondering when you were going to show up! Everything was spotless when I finished my service. The bikes been sitting for two weeks now. No leaks from primary cover gasket. When I noticed the leak, I cleaned everything spotless again. Even though drips were coming from the bottom of starter only, (no leaking where starter mounts to primary) I decided to partially pull out starter to inspect o-ring, knowing this was a waste of time. O-ring was perfect. Oil is definitely getting into starter. I’ll pull starter to open it up and thoroughly clean it even though that’s probably a waste of time. I imagine the oil is bypassing the shaft that pushes out the pinion gear. I have the perfect amount of oil in there because I researched everyone’s suggestions before I filled it. Do we think BDM will warranty the starter and send me a new one. I haven’t called yet until I exhaust all possibilities. Thanks

 

[Mikeinjersey]

If oil got into the starter, as you suspect, you do need to thoroughly clean it out . If you don't the starter will definitely get fried in the future and if Murphy has anything to do with it you will be 100 miles from home.
The transmission vent tube is in that area also. If you also replaced the trans fluid maybe it got overfilled and is spitting it out. The inner primary also has several seals including a transmission shaft seal which are possibilities. If you didn't replace the trans fluid check it now for the possibility it migrated into the primary through the seal. It could also go the other way and overfill the trans. I don't know which would be more likely. I'm sure someone on this site would know that answer.
Did the old starter have oil damage or did it just go bad?

 

[Snips]

If oil got into the starter, as you suspect, you do need to thoroughly clean it out . If you don't the starter will definitely get fried in the future and if Murphy has anything to do with it you will be 100 miles from home.
The transmission vent tube is in that area also. If you also replaced the trans fluid maybe it got overfilled and is spitting it out. The inner primary also has several seals including a transmission shaft seal which are possibilities. If you didn't replace the trans fluid check it now for the possibility it migrated into the primary through the seal. It could also go the other way and overfill the trans. I don't know which would be more likely. I'm sure someone on this site would know that answer.
Did the old starter have oil damage or did it just go bad?

First thing please……in my previous reply, I questioned if you thought BDM would possibly warranty this starter if proved to be a leaky shaft seal, allowing oil into the starter? Nothing has changed on the bike, regarding fluids, except for putting a new starter on.
Now to answer your thoughts. Trans was never touched, that level is fine. I did pull primary inspection cover to confirm that primary fluid level hadn’t changed. I’ve confirmed with thorough inspection that everything else on bike has no leaks and is clean and dry.
Regarding the old starter, it was dry and perfectly fine. If you recall, you guys helped me figure out a ghostly issue that I had with my wiring this summer. I had to install a whole new RIP wiring harness. I had started the bike this summer and the starter just kept cranking which smoked the damn thing before I could get it unplugged. I’ve never had any leaks on the bike until now.

 

[Mikeinjersey]

I can't speak for BDM but I would call them first to talk about it. The new starters had a new design which would drain any oil that got up to the area your speaking of back into the primary. You may be able to see it on the left side if you zoom in on the gear.
The only way past that area in order to leak under the starter is through the O-ring. Who knows maybe the o-ring is defective and leaks even though it looks good.

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[Snips]

I can't speak for BDM but I would call them first to talk about it. The new starters had a new design which would drain any oil that got up to the area your speaking of back into the primary. You may be able to see it on the left side if you zoom in on the gear.
The only way past that area in order to leak under the starter is through the O-ring. Who knows maybe the o-ring is defective and leaks even though it looks good.

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BRAND NEW 2.0kw CHROME STARTER FOR ALL 2005-2011 BIG DOG MOTORCYCLES MODELS WITH BAKER DSSC RIGHT SIDE DRIVE TRANSMISSION. THIS IS A BRAND NEW STARTER, WITH THE OIL RELIEF MACHINED INTO THE HOUSING. STARTER COMES ALL NEW! INCLUDING NEW SEALS, O-RINGS, & SEALED BEARINGS ***** 1-YEAR MANUFACTURER...

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Thank you. Yes. My research has educated me on that new design. The problem I have with your theory is that if the o-ring was bad, I believe the oil would be immediately leaking out the edge of the nose of the starter and down the side of the back of the primary case. Would I be correct?? Everything has stayed dry in that location. I guess the first step now is to remove starter and confirm that oil is truly on the inside of the starter, then I can move on from there. Thanks for all the help as usual.

 

[Mr. Wright]

It's not the o-ring on the outside of the housing, that seals it to the primary. It's an integrated o-ring around the jack shaft. The first attempt to fix this problem, was to put that relief slot in the nose so the oil would run back into the primary faster. This worked ok, but was a band aid for the real problem, which is the seal around the jack shaft, that isn't replaceable. The real break through fix, is what Knothead was saying. That is the billet nose cone. I believe all the starters coming from HDM, are this way now. Tell them down at BD that the seal is dry rotted in the starter, and if they don't have that billet upgrade, that you want your money back.

 

[Snips]

It's not the o-ring on the outside of the housing, that seals it to the primary. It's an integrated o-ring around the jack shaft. The first attempt to fix this problem, was to put that relief slot in the nose so the oil would run back into the primary faster. This worked ok, but was a band aid for the real problem, which is the seal around the jack shaft, that isn't replaceable. The real break through fix, is what Knothead was saying. That is the billet nose cone. I believe all the starters coming from HDM, are this way now. Tell them down at BD that the seal is dry rotted in the starter, and if they don't have that billet upgrade, that you want your money back.

Uh-oh. Thanks Mr. Wright. Shit. Maybe that’s what everyone has been saying all along. Maybe, as usual, I’m wrong again. Ok. I need to pull starter off anyhow and then I’ll be able to see exactly what you all are saying. I do know what you’re saying about that billet upgrade. I wish I knew about that one this summer. Oh well. Thanks for chiming in. Much appreciated

 

[Savage 1]

At MOCO, there is no serviceable seal available. Ya have to replace starter.

I know, years ago there was a seal on jack shaft, I think they changed it in 07. I haven't personally disassembled a newer one so I can't confirm or deny.
I only know that MOCO says it's not available for service.
I should say, the aftermarket probably sells the seal Mr. Wright mentioned.

Hope that helps....

 

[Mikeinjersey]

Thank you. Yes. My research has educated me on that new design. The problem I have with your theory is that if the o-ring was bad, I believe the oil would be immediately leaking out the edge of the nose of the starter and down the side of the back of the primary case. Would I be correct?? Everything has stayed dry in that location. I guess the first step now is to remove starter and confirm that oil is truly on the inside of the starter, then I can move on from there. Thanks for all the help as usual.

Yes you would be correct. Your plan to pull and inspect the starter is good.

 

[Mickmorris]

If you go to HDM’s website and click the link on the starter with the billet nose cone as though you intend to purchase. Then scroll down and read the description of the new design at the bottom there is a very informative video that Eric made that is very informative, helpful & interesting. I think you will fully understand your situation better. Good Luck!