engine hangs when first trying to start

[Coolbreezin]

I'll pull both plugs and see what happens. Both CR's were held down individually and collectively. Nothing had happened. No damage of any sort. No fluid changes. Risen every weekend and sometimes during the week. Always on battery tender.
It started hesitanting periodically a few months ago. Now here we are.

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

Thank you all for your questions and comments.
1) The battery was professionally load tested and showed in good condition. So i consider it ruled out.
2) I forgot to post that first thing I did was clean the starter contacts. Pretty beat up but still usable.
3) Both releases work fine, I felt them go down and back up.

As I stated above, I was told that maybe the starter internals are loose and thats wht it hangs up. Im no starterologists, so if anyone has input it is welcome.

Ok, while the battery was load tested and shown good this is not a guarantee. The load test done at most places tries to figure out your CA and maybe calculate (assuming alls well with battery) your CCA.
I have yet to find a place that properly tests the CCA of a battery since by defintion you must store it at 0degrees for 24hrs before you test it, What's the date code on the battery?
If it's over 3yrs or 4yrs old, I'd replace it lest be caught on the road with it dead.

 

[Sven]

Any way you can video what it's doing? I would think like Mike suggested, plugs out, that thing should spin like crazy. If it's doing something else or has no change, then it's the motor. Video without plugs in it.

 

[Coolbreezin]

Battery voltage shows 12.7 with key on. Drops to 5.5 when trying to turn over motor. Negative cable gets a little warm. Yes, everything is clean and tight.
I understand we have big motors with hi compression, but shouldn't a regular car battery turn over our motors?

 

[Sven]

Just went out to my bike. 12.4 at the battery. Hit the brake light and it went to 12.3. It was so quick, I'm sticking with what I saw was 11.1 and when it started, right back to 12.4v when I killed it as soon as it started.

5.5v???? No PUSH!

Volts = Push

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

Battery voltage shows 12.7 with key on. Drops to 5.5 when trying to turn over motor. Negative cable gets a little warm. Yes, everything is clean and tight.
I understand we have big motors with hi compression, but shouldn't a regular car battery turn over our motors?

If battery drops to 5.5 V IT IS A BAD BATTERY most likely. Should never drop much below 10V even under worse conditions starting.

So you either have a BAD BATTERY -- most likely.
Or your starter is burnt out and shorted internally.

If the starter was shorted internally and drawing that much current your battery terminals would be EXTREMELY HOT and one the verge of melting if the start button was held more more than 1 sec.

CHANGE THE BATTERY!

If you want to test with car battery disconnect the PLUS cable from the starter -- hook it to car battery, hook battery to good ground with thick cable
Hook plus from car battery to starter (again heavy cable) then hit the start on the bike.
Monitor the car battery voltage while doing this. If it drops to 5.5v like before its the starter, if it spins up like normal it's the bikes battery.

 

[nvcollins]

I agree, change the battery.

Sent from my SM-A426U using Tapatalk

 

[FrankBDPS]

Ain't that what I wrote in post #6? Nobody listens to an old man any more. How many times has it been the battery. Good luck. Hope you get it sorted out.

 

[Sven]

Signed,

... post #6? Nobody listens to...

... Frankie

 

[Coolbreezin]

Thank you all for your time and knowledge. Purchased MMG6 lithium battery (which I have had before) and the motor fired right up. I just cannot understand why these bikes go through batteries so fast?

 

[Sven]

Cool, Story goes like this: Hello Yuasa tech, battery sat dry for 2 years on a leftover bike. It is good to go? Yes. We take our competitors batteries, and dead cycle them 3 times. That's pour the acid in and let it soak in for over an hour at least. Fully charge the battery at its rating. Then take and drain it till it reads 1 or 2v and charge it back up again and then do that two more times. Third time it's ready for service.

Did exactly that. One lasted 8yrs. This one I just wet it and charged it and put it in service. I'd be looking at the cycled battery hitting at 12.7-12.8v in the static.

When I went out to start the bike with this wet and service, it's at 12.4v static. So I expect half it's life due to just wet and service. So I always buy BS [battery acid supplied] batteries and prep it x3. This one is a test just to see how long the same battery will last without the prep. Thus the 12.4v is a sign.

Should you x3 that battery now? Hard to say. If you could buy those dry, then I'd give it a go. Not sure, but it does mix that water and acid a lot more in the chemistry of it. Same exact batteries.

 

[FrankBDPS]

Glad you got you're starting issue sorted out.

You ask why these bikes go thru batteries so much. There are several reasons. Since you have a new battery check you're charging voltage. It should be around 14 volts. If it ain't you have more work to do. Second the battery in these bikes takes a physical beating. Even when the bike is at idle it vibrates and that vibration continues while riding. This vibration takes its toll on the spacing of the plates inside the battery. Another words it beats the guts out of the battery. Another is the starting load placed on the battery. The high amperage demanded to start these high compression engines heats up the internals of the battery and take a toll on the plates also shorting battery life.

Best thing to do is get a good battery TENDER. Not a charger but a tender that will maintain you're battery at full charge between rides so that you have a fully charged battery to get that S&S to roll over.

Ride safely.

 

[Sven]

What Frank said. Once the new battery is installed, go right back to the meter, set it to 20v and now watch the engine idle. It should spike to 14+v. Rev it with a blip and the volts should rise to 14.6-7v being the ideal number, but you won't see that too often. Say 14.2-14.4v and the whole charging loop is fine. Just a battery going bad.

 

[Coolbreezin]

Awesome info. Thanks Frank. My previous lithium battery did vibrate loose internally. Hence, the AGM battery.

FYI, AGM battery was installed 23 May 2020. So I got my 18 months out of it, Im happy.

 

[Coolbreezin]

UPDATE: new 420cca lithium battery (same as before) & new starter from Shovelheadlicker. Both CR's go down (new ones r&r professionally about 7 years ago).

Originally with just the new battery, the bike did turnover fine. After a few starts and riding around it became more resistant and now I'm back to square one. I just installed the new starter and it won't get past the first crank, even using the slam button. Checked all connections and 40amp fuse, all is fine.
Any ideas?

 

[Mikeinjersey]

UPDATE: new 420cca lithium battery (same as before) & new starter from Shovelheadlicker. Both CR's go down (new ones r&r professionally about 7 years ago).

Originally with just the new battery, the bike did turnover fine. After a few starts and riding around it became more resistant and now I'm back to square one. I just installed the new starter and it won't get past the first crank, even using the slam button. Checked all connections and 40amp fuse, all is fine.
Any ideas?

Have you checked your charging system? If the new battery cranked good but progressively got weaker as you used the bike over the past few days it could be your VR or Stator. Charge up the new battery and start the bike. It should read 13.6 to 14.5 across the battery terminals while running above idle. Even at idle mine charges at 14.2. If your bike charges well you probably/may have a healthy parasitic drain going on.
This link may help you. https://www.batterystuff.com/kb/art.../testing-your-battery-for-parasitic-load.html

 

[Coolbreezin]

Great info, but not applicable. I had a voltmeter permanently mounted under the seat. It tells me constantly where it's at. This new battery is more than capable to spin the engine.
Maybe the CR's open/close so fast the compressed air doesn't leave the chamber in time? I'll pull the plugs again see how freely it spins.

 

[Coolbreezin]

I give the throttle two twists and sometimes use the choke. However, the problem isnt starting, its rotating.

 

[Coolbreezin]

Gave it another try with above set up. I heard a loud click sound, almost mechanical than electrical, and that was it, battery dropped to about 5volts. I charged it up, put the old starter back in and removed the plugs. Now it doesnt even click, everything (speedo, voltmeter, idiot lights, everything) just turns off. Ill get new hot and cold cables tomorrow. Doubt it will help, but Im hoping to fix this situation instead of paying the shop to do it.
Anymore ideas?

 

[Coolbreezin]

Another update: removed battery and tried to start it straight from battery. Turned the key, loud click, nothing happened mechanically but the whole electrical system turned off. I had the bike rewired 2-3 years ago. was removed and no problems at all until this.
New battery has been fried. So will be r&r that.